Thu Jun 11 20:24:36 PDT 1998

Rhenish,

This site is a challenge for individuals, but we also share our thoughts and theories to help each other out. There's no prize, but it's fun. There's an assigned chat room, but we're waiting for the detective to set up a meeting time for us to discuss the case interactively.

Go to the "Reality Check" item on the pull-down menu for more info about Crimescene.

Good luck!

suzd

Response: Thanks for helping out, suzd. Feel free to use the chat rooms anytime, details on chat here.

i think the killer is the mailman

Response: Thanks for your comment. What makes you point to Thomas Joe Hinkley?

Ok, I'm ready for more new information!!! Im really anxious to know more...my brain is hungary!!!
masso

Response: More information coming.

I posted this comment but no one answered me before. So this time I thought I'd stick an e-mail address in and maybe some person will take pity on my ignorant self. I'm not sure I'm clear as to how this thing works. Is this just an attempt to see if the individual can figure out who the murder is or is he racing against fellow visitors to the site? Also are these fictious cases or what? I'm sure there are answers somewhere but I'm new to this whole computer thing so I'd appreciate some help. Thanks.
Rhenish
Here's my e-mail [email protected]

Response: Sorry I've been slow to answer. I see some of the other great folks have helped you out.

I've been doing some research and I discovered that if a victim is dead (the heart stopping) that little blood will be present when there is cutting afterward. Since there was very little blood on the ground by Lisa's head 4"by6" maybe she was sufficated with some wet laundry first then maybe whoever killed Richard hit her in the head to confuse us about how she died cause we are certainly confused. So what do you think about that.
rayson

Response: This is true and the coroner's opinion was that Lisa Izard died nearly instantly thus bleeding little. Cause of death was from the blow to the head, not suffocation though. Thanks for the comments.

Did the Izards have any extended family?

Response: Neither Richard or Lisa Izard had surviving siblings. Both of their sets of parents were alive and living in the area in 1958. There are no other relatives that we know of. There were none in the area at the time.

Found it a bit strange good old Doris Hammack went on and on about her poor, pitiful childhood without expressing interest (or even curiosity) in what happened to her brother, Ricky. Seems there's hardly no mention of him by anyone. Think someone is holding back info regarding him to drag this on at a snail's pace?

Response: Doris Hammack has stated that if she is in fact LeAnne Izard that one of her priorities will be to determine what happened to Ricky. We have no information on Ricky Izard's whereabouts at all.

I just read the comments(something I do 4-5x's a day), and liked the idea of setting up a time for a bunch of people to be on the chat line at the same time. Ever since it has come into existence I go to it, but no one else is ever there. This is the first crimescene i've been a part of and it is VERY ADDICTING!!!!!! Please e-mail me, if there is a designated chat time set up. thanks!!!!!!!
wix
[email protected]

Response: Feel free to post any regular times here also. I'll drop by when I can.

It is interesting that the Hawkins woman knew about the package from Sears, however, in rural areas, especially in the South everyone knows everything about everyone else. This leads me to believe that its pretty evident that the knowledge about the Sears package is irrelevant BUT Lydia Catlett and Yvonne Hawkins were at home all day. I find it hard to believe that they found time in their busy schedules to mind their own business. While I don't belive that either of them had anything to do with the crime, I think one or both of them saw something, probably without even realizing it that is important. I very much hold with the theory that whoever was there, belonged there. Is it possible that someone, perhaps a "friend" of Richard Izard was with him in his vehicle when he got home. This person could have been one of his buddies from the factory who he had just laid off and he was trying to reassure him, perhaps. This brings the whole thing back to Warren who was a fishing and poker buddy of Izard.

This is just a thought, I just discovered this site today and am hooked.
B

Response: Welcome to Crime Scene. Good points you may be right. Thanks for the comments.

With all the information now coming in, I'm sure that everyone has lots of theories and ideas of their own. I think it would be a good idea if we got together at a certain time in the chat room to go over these...if we can combine some, this might make sense. If anyone wants to comment, or has an idea for a meeting time, write back.Masso

Response: Good suggestion. Post it here if times are established for getting together and I'll drop in when I can.

I would like more info about Elbert Warren. His alibi sounds really fishy to me- being attacked by unknown assailants for seemingly no reason, knocked unconscious, and then, when he wakes up, going to look for a job? With blood all over his face? Doesn't sit well with me. And he sent his wife away, too. I'd like to know the date and time she was sent away-it's possible she took the children. There was blood on the playpen, so evidently the killer took the little girl- it would be interesting to know whose blood that was. I think Elbert, his wife, and possibly his kids know what happened that day, and they should be interviewed.
-Sunshower

Response: Elbert Warren stated that he went to the reservoir to find Elliott Perch to discuss getting a union job with him, it was there he was attacked. Mrs. Warren left with her children several days prior to the union vote which was held on Thursday, April 10, 1958. Detective McPhail agrees with you, however, nothing concrete could be established to warrant an arrest of Elbert Warren. See his most recent interview here.

This case is getting stranger and stranger all the time.
An interesting problem, establishing the identity of Doris.
Also, why is there a recording of a chant that school children made up? That's somewhat creepy to me. If the recording was made back at the time of the murders (or shortly afterward, I wuod assume) it may have been made by the killer. A trophy? Maybe...

Response: The chant developed as part of the local folklore you might say at the time of the murders. Lomax made recordings to preserve that heritage and this one of the recordings.

I just discovered this site today and I am hooked!! The thought of Richard killing his wife never crossed my mind until I saw it in the comments, but it almost makes sense. I can't wait to see how this case turns out! How about the idea of DNA testing the blood samples from the scene and comparing them not only to the would be Izard child, but to the still living suspects? I think the blood and injuries to the number one suspect in the case are pretty incriminating. Why were they dismissed so easily? Could the blood on the shirt he was wearing be compared to the blood from the victims at the murder scene?
This is a great site and I'll be visiting it daily!!!
[email protected]

Response: Welcome to Crime Scene, Rosie. We have submitted the original evidence to see if DNA testing is possible. Yes, the blood was compared at the time by typing and karyotype. The blood was consistent with Elbert Warren but not with the Izards. He wasn't ruled out and remains today Detective McPhail's first suspect. More forensic material will be posted. Thanks for your comments.

this is a follow-up to my previous theory about lisa dying first, murdered by richard who planned to bury her in the garden. i realize it is dangerous to read too much into the detectives ambiguous replies to comments, but i just found his reponse to a comment from may 17 23:57:39 pdt that "gardens play a role in this case. snerc

Response: My original comment wasn't meant to be a cryptic clue to a body buried in a garden, sorry if I misled you. The Izard garden was checked out and dug and no additional evidence was uncovered.

the crime scene report shows that richard's wife was killed earlier than he was. her blood was brown and dry and she seemed to show more lividity. Richard's blood was red and liquid. perhaps richard killed his own wife, possibly because she was having an affair with danahy. he may have been planning to bury her in the garden using the shovel when someone else - perhaps danahy - came on the scene and killed richard out of rage at richard"s murder of his wife.

Response: Good observation. Another possible explanation for the difference in drying effect might also be the amount of blood. Lisa Izard bled much less than Richard Izard. Thanks for the comments.

Is it possible that Mr Hammack could be Mrs Lydia Catletts son Henry? It was stated that Hammack had an accent. Henry Catlett had worked in Chicago. Maybe "the old biddy" is mrs Catlett? Can't really find a reason for why Henry Catlett would take the Izzards daughter, unless he was persuaded by his mother for some reason. The woman giving up the little girl to the sisters in Detroit could be Henrys daughter in law. It would be interesting to check out if Henry is still alive. If not, check when, where and how he died...

Response: No. Henry and George Catlett's whereabouts are known during the period, they were in Jackson.

if danahy and corey died in a car wreck in 1964, that does not change your theory that danahy is mr. hammack, it's still possible, look at it this way: danahy is afraid of apprehension, he takes leann away, he keeps her for two years because he is afraid of being apprehended, but in 1960, something changes so keeping the girl is no longer important to him, perhaps the case was officially closed or something. it's possible. it's not my theory about what happened, but don't abandon yours because it's still plausible.
niki

Response: Keep in mind too, that we can make a connection between Doris Hammack and Howard Hammack in Detroit, but as yet have nothing concrete to connect Doris or Howard Hammack to LeAnne Izard.

fellow sleuths
Been going over Doris/LeAnne interview again and the intake report by DSS. It says that Mr. Hammack lived at the apartment building for sometime before Doris came to live with him and that he had an accent but we don't know weather the accent was foreign or southern.In her dreams/memory she talks about 2 people the mean man coming back to be her daddy and the old biddy who took her away. Puzzling was the old biddy the one who took her away from the Izard house or did she take her away from Mr. Hammack? When the PI found the family that was her neighbors they didn't seem to know that Mr. Hammack had a heart attack and died I assumed they knew and that was were Doris stayed until someone came to get her. But maybe she was taken from him before he died.
Also other commenters have stated that the woman who dropped Doris off was young but everything I read just said she was unknown no description was available. Maybe there is something in The records at the catholic school from one of the nuns.I wonder why did the nuns dismiss her stories so readily? The only info they got was that her parents were dead? If I was told this little girls parents were dead and she was having nightmares of blood and someone hurting her parents since they knew she came from Mississippi someone should have looked into it. Seems strange nobody seemed to care especially since it was an ongoing problem her whole childhood and she was returned over and over again because nobody could deal with her dreams.

Det. Nelson
Is somone looking through the records of the school itself for clues?
[email protected]

Response: The records have all been checked, yes. What we've posted from social services is all there is with the exception of the actual health records which do not appear at all relevant and Ms. Hammack does not want posted. No other descriptions of the woman who dropped Doris off exist and the nuns that were there at the time are deceased. An effort was made by social services to track Doris' family, however, the only connection found was to Hammack and that ended the search.

Well if you check out Detective's answers to the first week of questions we now know that Danahy and corey were killed in a car wreck in 1964 which blows my theory that Danah was the mysterious Mr.Hammack. So does anyone have any suggestions as to who or why this Mr. Hammack had an interest in LeAnne?She seemed only important to him once he died she was dumped off at the orphanage in Detroit not Chicago as one person commented.
rayson

Response: So far we haven't uncovered more information on Hammack, but we are looking. We'll keep you posted.

I am just curious to why Danahy was written off as a suspect. Looking at the list of layed off workers he doesn't seem to have an alibi...g

Response: Danahy was not cleared as a suspect. See the suspect information here. You are correct, he had no alibi.

I'd just like to say THANK YOU!!!!
to the Crimescene team after receiving my amazing prize package in the mail at work today.
Anyone else reading this, it was a great contest!!!
(Yes..I am saying that as a winner)
I entered the Crimescene contest a few weeks ago but explained that I lived in Australia and didn't think I'd be eligible. Well..I got an email back saying I had won a T-shirt and please send my address, so I sent my work address.
And, snail mail being what it is, it arrived today!!!
Sensational!!!
Have to add Oxford to my must-see list of places (I now think the county is fictional but Oxford really exists, after the enclosed postcard from there).
Loved the packaging with "EVIDENCE" stamped all over and the Hanes T-shirt for the county police.
Nice touch to wrap it all up in fluro yellow Crime Scene tape and I liked the evidence bag and the missing person Crimescene flattened 1.8 litre milk carton. (Interesting also because our milk cartons are 1 litre maximum, after that you get 2 litle plastic recyclable bottles).
Just have to work out where the fluro yellow Crime Scene tape goes in my house.
Anyyway, I am as confused as anyone else about the current crime.
Still thinking along the lines of debt and payback. Maybe I can help if you need any leads for a future storyline involving Australia.
Cheeky1
Ps...saw criticism about your stance on social justice issues but
that's the way to go, I reckon (as we say down here)

Response: Very pleased to hear your package arrived just fine. Yes, Oxford is indeed a real place! Thanks for your support. The Crime Scene T-shirts are very nice, more info on them here for those interested. Thanks for your support.

Given the detectives extensive education (for the time), it appears
he has not utilized all of the resources available in 1958 or 1998
(for whatever reason). There are far too many loose ends in this case
and no good excuse provided for the lack of diligence on his part.
WHY????
the vicar

Response: What resources do you feel are being overlooked?

My questions are too numerous to list here, however I'll put down a few ?s & observations. Why does the detective have on a coat at that temperature (covering up blood stains maybe)? Also the shadows on the photograph of the bodies
with the detective neeling are inconsistent with the time and direction the photo was taken from (if the maps are correct). I still contend that all the "Sear's deliveries" were not from Sears. Rather, they were payoffs and the delivery of the boots
may have been part of the cover up. Someone should check with Sears to see who and when the order was placed.
the vicar

Response: The time the the photos were taken late in the day after the bodies had been moved. The Sears delivery of the shoes was legit, the order was placed by Lisa Izard two weeks earlier. Interesting idea on a way to make payoffs. Thanks for the comments.

Ok, they are trying to establish if the woman really is the daughter of the Izzards through comparing certain features of the ear (as unique as a fingerprint so I've heard...no punt intended)
g

Response: This is true. An expert in this area has offered to analyze this information. We will report findings as soon as they are received.

*The male victims shoes were of the same size as the new shoes from Sears.
*No bloodsamples have been checked for dna proof establishing the womans claim of being the dissappearde daughter or for any other cause.
*Seemingly, the old boyfriend, mr Danahy, was ruled out as a suspect in the -58 investigation. Police is now trying to establish the reasons why...g

Response: Correct. DNA testing was not available in 1958 therefore there are no existing records for the Izards. Danahy was never cleared as a suspect in 1958 though. Thanks for the comments.

Hello,
The woman who dropped the child off with the sisters in Chicago. What was her physical discription? Next what type vehicle do the following people drive?
Harvey Booker *
Nathan Buck *
Pete Corey *
Lance Cummings
Jessie Danahy *
Howard Hadley *
Wes Hannaford *
Walter Hinkley *
Kitty Ingram
Wendell Kirby
Earl Long *
Joe Mitchell
Dora Noland
Ralph Quillens *
Ed Rebstock *
Elbert Warren
Jimmy Warren *
The stars after the name are the suspects never fully cleared in 1958. Is that all of them?
[email protected]

Response: We don't have a good description of the woman that dropped Doris off in Detroit at the children's home. None of the eye witnesses are living today. On the list of suspects, some of those were cleared but had no direct alibi for the time of the murders. The suspects who remained after all information was verified and investigated are posted under suspects developed here. We don't have vehicle information on all of those people in your list, but we'll post what we have for the others.

Okay, this is a long shot, but Richard and Lisa might not have been killed by the same person. Richard could have whacked Lisa on the head and then LeAnn could have battered him in revenge. Then maybe Lee Harvey Oswald (in the area, posing as Eliot Perch) arrived in a spaceship and kidnapped her and Ricky. Doris Hammack is a clone of LeAnn (you've all seen the X-Files). Neat theory, huh?
Sure, the killer's right-handed if they were facing the victims, but I can't help imagining Lisa hanging up the washing and getting hit from behind...

Response: Ha! Thanks for the comments.

Here's some more areas of inquiry I've developed:

After reviewing the layoff list:
1. Eleven people were laid off that were not union sympathizers. We know Jestes was one because he was a poor performer/drunkard. Why were the others laid off? Would one of them have been more likely to blame Richard Izard, not aware of his ties to the union?
2. Seven people on the layoff list (not including Jimmy Warren) are noted as "cleared" wihtout having an alibi. How were they cleared without one?
3. Four people who are related to one another are named Jackson. That's a lot of people in one family to lose their jobs. Ernest Jackson, who lives at Box 205, was not employed at the plant, and claims absolutley no knowledge of the layoffs or the Izards. Is he possibly related to the laid off group? Granted, Jackson is a common name, but was Ernest's alibi (at Peeper's Cafe) ever verified? Kuhn's report does not say.
4. Is the laid off person named Linda Parker related to the Parkers who live at Box 215?

Another question:
Hannah Waithers- Was not seen since 2:15, just after talking to Abbot on the phone. Also, when did she ever talk to Ricky Izard and learn about his playhouse in the woods, and him being a scout? Could Abbot have told her something bad was going to go down, to pick up Ricky from the bus and take him away? She didn't get home until 5:20. Since she wasn't interviewed until 6:30, she would have had time to pull herself together and give such a calm interview.

Any thoughts, sleuthers?

suzd

Response: We don't have specific reasons for all of those laid off from Bowlan Glove. Harold Bowlan was taking advantage of the situation to rid the plant of troublemakers and cut costs. Those who were cleared without an alibi generally were cleared because of verifiable information that would not have allowed them to be at the scene of the crime at the time of the murders. The Jackson's on the layoff list were all related however, not all in the same household. Sadie and Pearl were sisters, Nathaniel and Thaddeus were cousins. Jackson on County Road 106 was not related that we know of. All the information provided by County Road residents was verified. Linda Parker is not related to the Parkers at Box 215. Detective McPhail did not believe Hannah Waithers was involved, however, we'll see what we can find in that direction.

Something I found interesting was that Mr. Jestes(the public drunk) lives right on the other side of the creek from the Izard's. If the murder was pre-meditated anyone could have easily known where he lived and that he would be out drinking or passed out and gotten away through his property.

Response: True. Thanks for the comments.

After reading over new info. and new messages, I thought Mrs. Catlett's interview should have a 2nd look:
1. She clears Hawkins by saying she(Tina/Yvonne) was on the phone all day(and Hawkins;in her interview, struck me as the type of being a bigshot,busybody, know-it-all).
2. How did Mr. Shaw(previous owner of Izard property)
die?
3. Mrs. Catlett makes "subtle" bad remarks about Lisa:
A. "don't know if she invited the attention"
B. "who knows about young women today"
C. "different generation"
4. She never really explains who "he" is that is smoking the cigarette. All she says for sure that it is not
Mrs. Izard. I don't recall ANYTHING about Richard
smoking.
5. She mentions her grandson(who, knows quite a bit
about the dirty side of the unions) is having a baby.
He is also the only one who visits regulary besides
the mailman. So, who is her grandson????????
6. I thought it odd that she assumed that the children
were already dead.
Just thought all of this interesting and deserving a second look. I don't think that Mrs. Catlett had anything to do with the murders personally but, may know more than she had said.

Response: Shaw died a natural death of old age. Mrs. Catlett's grandson is George who lived in Jackson, MS at the time with his wife Kate who was expecting their first child. Thanks for the comments.

Two other people and I were chatting all day, trying to come up with information. this is what we have. We think that the murderer may have been one of the ladies on the block (Tina or Lydia) so we have these questions: What is Lydia Catlett's sons name? Where in "the North" does he live? What about Tina Hawkins's sister? What's her name? Where does she live? We also think that Tommy joe Hinkley may have covered some things up on the mistaken belief that his brother Aaron Hinkley was somehow involed: can we have more infor on Aaron Hinkley? where did he work? Was he sympathetic to the union? Did he have amotive to kill either Lisa or Richard Izard? We would also like to know which side of the creek the blanket and other things were found. The Izard side? or on the same side as 207,205 etc?

Response: Lydia Catlett's son's name is Henry, he lived in Chicago for several years then relocated to Jackson, MS in 1957 where he lived with his family at the time of the murders. Her grandson also lived in Jackson with his wife at the time. Tina Hawkins' sister's name was Ida and she lived in Oxford at the time, she was as widow. Aaron Hinkley lived in Oxford in 1958 selling insurance. His union sympathies are not known. He sold a life insurance policy to Richard Izard, Lisa Izard was the beneficiary. The policy was paid out to the estate and probated eventually used to pay off the debts of the Izards' leaving little left over. The blanket and cap were found on the Izard side of County Road 106, behind their home to the south. See map for location.

i believe that Mr. Hammack was one of the perps and that the woman who dropped the little girl off at the catholic home was his unwilling partner in the crime and after his death she no longer wanted the little girl near or around her in fear of being linked to the murders through his death. I believe he (Mr. Hammack from Detroit) was hired by Mr. Bowlan to commit the murders while he was away on vacation (how convienent) but I also believe that the wife, Lisa, was not supposed to be murdered. Doris is definitely Leanne. Little Ricky has got to be dead, he was six years old and very capable of describing who committed the crimes and would have been a liability where as Leanne would "assumingly" forget what had happpened, or possibly someone should check the schools records to see if any six year old boys had been delivered there in 1958, possibly if the accomplice had used the school for the girls they had used the school for the boy earlier on.

Response: The school records were checked, nothing there that we can find in Detroit. Thanks for the theory, good thoughts.

If the playpen and family momentos were taken into evidence, can't some of the baby LeAnnes' finger prints be matched to Doris'?

Response: I'll check on that, thanks for the comment.

Why did Elroy Murphy (bus driver)go to Willy's Auto and look at some new tires for his truck?
Niki

Response: That did seem promising, however the records on truck tires show that his existing tire tread did not match the pattern found at the crime scene.

Detective Nelson
Would be interesting to get death certificate of Howard Hammack. Howard had to have had contact with someone from Mississippi because after he died someone possibly his sister, came and took LeAnne/Doris to the Catholic Home for Girls. She new that LeAnne/Doris hailed from Mississippi and that her parents were killed. Makes me think of the Stouts, Manny was 58 years old and could have had the heart attack. Velma a spinster, would have been 48 or 49 when LeAnne was 5 maybe that is the old biddy she is referring to. I still wonder why take LeAnne at all she wasn't sold on the black market adoption, she was hidden away in Michigan for what purpose, she certainly didn't seem important after Hammack died she was just dumped off at the Catholic home. Someone should be able to find out if Manny left the area after the Izards murders and possible check phone records to see if Velma made calls to Michigan. I maybe way off about this I'm just trying to figure out who Hammack is reading the bio's and interviews Manny fits the age of someone who would have a heart attack two years later. I don't think they had anything to do with the murders since they were gone that day but they may have found her wandering around and got her out of the area to save her. *Note you know the picture of Mr. Bowlands reminds me of Mr. Burns on the Simpsons

Response: The death certificate for Howard Hammack contains no information other than date and cause of death, August 20, 1960. He had a fatal heart attack. The information on this certificate in the Detroit Social Services Intake Report is all there is. Phone records are unavailable for the period, however, we'll look into the Stout's. Ha! Mr. Burns.

I went onto the chat room, but noone else was there. i guess I'll try back later. I've noticed something that is VERY interesting. A lot of you guys are timing the death of both Izards at the same time, and are using the fact that the laundry was still wet to say that the murders were comitted between 2:00p and 2:45p when the bodies were discovered. Well here are some things to think about. Everyone is focusing on the union payoffs and things, and everyone is looking for a male murderer. But I think that's what the murderer wants us to think. Look at Mrs. Hawkins's interview again. Some things about her interview strike me as suspicious. The first thing that Tina Hawkins does is tell the police that she thinks that the union people are responsible. Everyone else is reluctant to place blame on anyone, but she immediately tells them who she thinks the murderer is. Second, she tells them about the car and says "he" when referring to the murderer.When asked why she assumes the murderer is male, she states that a woman could not be guilty of such brutality. These two things may be her attempt to throw off the investigators. Send them looking for male union workers, which is exactly what they do. The fact that 40 years later the trail is still cold, points to the fact that maybe it wasn't union workers. We are almost positive from Dorris Hammack's and others' interviews that there is a woman involved in this case. Tina Hawkins did say that she has adult children. What are their names? Where do they live?
But I think that we should all look at these few things. First, we are talking about a relatively hot day in Mississippi, it's 78 degrees outside. If any of you are from the South, you know that 78 degrees in the Mississippi sun is not the same as 78 degrees in New England or the Midwest, especially since it was a clear cloudless day. It was probably just dry stifling stuffy heat. The bodies would not have gone cold, even if a little time had passed between the murders and the discovery of the body. Noone should use that to try to time the murders, just because the bodies were warm does not mean that it was such a short time between the deaths and the discovery. Everyone is talking as if the Izards died instantly. What if they didn't. A head injury could leave them unconcious, but not necessarily immediately dead. I still think that we should work with the 12p-2:45p time frame. We have to consider ALL possibilities. Don't rush to draw conclusions based on appearances in an effort to solve things. If it is possible, we have to keep it in mind.
Second, a lot of people are using the wet clothes to time the murders. Wet clothes sitting on a line for and hour would dry, but what about wet clothes in a pile, the way these were found? That would take a little longer to dry than if they were hung up. Also, did anyone notice that Tina Hawkins said that she was also doing laundry? What if the laundry was washed after the deaths? That is very possible. Everyone is assuming that the murders were a spur of the minute crime of passion, but that is not necessarily true. Everyone knew about the union, and about Bowlan threatening lay-offs. That is the perfect cover-up for well-planned murders. If it was something so obvious, we would not be trying so hard to figure out this case forty years later. Tina Hawkins could have easily washed some of the laundry again to not only indicate that the murders happened later than they did, but also to make it seem as if Lisa ran to her husbands aid.
It seems to me that whoever said that it was the other way around is very perceptive. I believe that Lisa was the primary victim. Wet laundry could have been planted, or dropped by Lisa after she was first hit. did anyone notice that in the police report that the pool of blood around Lisa was drying, while the pool of blood around Richard was still liquid? this might indicate that Lisa died first, and that maybe they didn't die at the same time.
Eveeryone is assuming that Richard was so badly beaten because he was the primary victim, or because whoever committed the murders felt more anger towards Richard. What if it was simply because Lisa was relatively equal to her attacker in stregnth, thus, very few blows to kill Lisa, but Richard was superior to his attacker and the killer neede to hit him more often and harder in r=order to gain the upper hand? That might point to a female assailant.
There are also these things that I keep saying over and over again. Even if the murders were committed later, whoever it was belonged on that block, the only person that could avoid detection was someone who belonged there. The police kept asking did you see anyone strange on the block. Of course the answer would be NO when the person responsible BELONGED there.
Last HOW DID TINA HAWKINS KNOW THAT THE PACKAGE WAS FROM SEARS?
Niki

Response: The Hawkins had two children, Ada and Thadeus, Ada married and moved to Texas, Thadeus married and lived in Alabama in 1958. He returned to the area in the late '60's. One of the factors that helps to establish how quickly the Izards died is the amount of bleeding. Richard Izard bled heavily while Lisa Izard did not, she likely died nearly instantly. Interesting idea about the laundry being rewashed or planted. Good points, thanks for the theories.

Columbo again. Just one other thing: After the murders, who took Richard Izard's position as foreman at the plant?

Response: A fellow by the name of Jason Edwards. He was cleared by the original investigation of any involvement, and that appears to have been a good call.

Harold Bowlan is the real murderer in this case. Mr. Bowlan found out about Richard Izard's secret dealings with the union and considered Izard a corrupt traitor, so he set him up to be murdered by ordering Izard to lay off the 153 workers. Bowlan, of course, knew of danahy's romantic involvement with Mrs. Izard, and he also knew how violent some of the hotheads who worked for him could be, plus he realized that Perch would feel betrayed by Izard and could have union musclemen go after Izard.

So, no matter who PHYSICALLY killed the Izards, they were not the real murderers, they were actually Bowlan's murder weapon. To put it simply: If there were no layoffs, there would have been no murder.

Oh, and just one more thing....I think we've overlooked the fact that little Ricky Izard was a boy scout, therefore he probably had some survival skills. He may have survived. Just a thought.

Columbo

Response: It is possible that Bowlan was behind the murders, however, he was physically in Memphis at the time of the murders requiring a conspiracy as you suggest. It is also possible that Ricky Izard, and LeAnne Izard did survive, we just don't know.

o.k, im really new at this, but what if it was a complete stranger to not only the family, but to the town? in the 50's, a lot of people were down on there luck, and didnt have anywhere to call home, and therefore did a lot of rambling around. Maybe some individual was out looking for a polace to lay low for the day, saw the house, and therfore mrs.izard, and attempted to rape her, Mr. izard, seeing the attack taking place from the drive, rushed to his wifes defence, and was then in a fight with the assailent. after the struggle, both were dead, and maybe, little ricky was comming home from school, and happened on the scene, therefore making it nessasary for the murderer to take him, being the only witness, and maybe ricky made mention of his sister, or she heard the camotion and cried, drawing attention to herself, thus making her a liability that needed to be taken as well. this is all speculation, but hey, it makes since to me!

Response: That's a possibility. In a homicide under these circumstances generally we try to work outward from those closest to the victim to strangers. There was plenty of motive and suspects close to home who were not able to be eliminated in this case, however, that does not rule out a stranger.

OK, so now I know Elroy Murphy (bus driver) was "considered and cleared." But does anyone know why he punched Jimmy Warren at Sid's? How did he remember what Ricky was wearing in such detail? Why did he clean out the bus after finishing his route? He had bald tires, maybe he was at the Izard's earlier, still upset about the mailbox. Maybe he decided to spite the Izard's by snatching Ricky. Someone mentioned that the killer(s) aren't necessarily the kidnappers(s). Maybe Elroy took little Ricky completely separate and/or unaware of the murders. Someone said something about the suspects "belonging" near the scene. Elroy was seen.

Response: Interesting ideas to consider. The buses were cleaned out at least lightly daily from what we understand. The tire tracks found in the Izard driveway would not match those on the school bus. Thanks for the comments.

Ahh yes, from hearing Ms. Hammacks interview, i am convinced she is linked to the Izards. Listening to her interview and the way she is spoke she sounds like a very hurt person, yes it may be because of the unstable youth she had.But she really has her story straight. Det. how come you don't show the actual crime photos? maybe one of us, will be able to notice something which may help you out in your investigation.
Kahluiee

Response: We may post more photos. Agree, Doris has had a hard life, we hope to resolve her connection, if any, to the Izard murder cases.

Can someone tell me why we aren't getting responses to all of our questions? Thanx......:-)

Response: Catching up on answering as fast as I can. Lots of good ideas, comments, theories. We read every day and find the comments very helpful. Keep posting and we'll try to keep up with you.

According to my criminal justice classes , a good witness , i believe if any would be an elderly person, for such reasons i speak of this, is because most of the time, elderly people have not a thing to do. Ms.Catlett for example, who lives alone, has nothing to do but observe her surroundings. She might not be able to hear all that great, but there are no indications that her eyes are impared. Her interview gives clues which may possibly be a lead. Elderly people are very observant, just to let you know.

Response: Very true. Her information led to many details on the meetings at Hannah Waithers and likely were the primary source of discovery for union payoff information.

don't do chat. I don't know how,and forbiden to.
t.

Response: Feel free to keep posting here in comments. Many good theories and questions.

Det. Nelson
I guess we can't use the chat room because it only sets up 82% you need to set it up for this case we are ahead of you you have alot of amiture sleuths waiting to solve this case
[email protected]

Response: Use these links let us know if you have more trouble.

Detective Nelson
Can't get into chat room for AOL says it has moved if there is a chat room for us please E-Mail us the address so we can compare notes it seems we are working on this case faster than you can supply the clues and we like to compare notes to follow this game of *CLUE and solve it
[email protected]

Response: All the comments have been very well thought out and helpful. Chat details here.

There is a crime scene chat room at:
http://www.crimescene.com/crime/javachat.html

Its Java room, so you better have Netscape or Microsoft Internet Explorer. It works pretty well too. Can we use it Det Nelson?
R.R

Response: Anytime!

Have I missed something? Is there a chat room for CrimeScene or is someone suggesting one. I think it would be nice, I can obsess with someone about this case in real time. My husband would be thrilled.

Response: Details on chat here.

I agree with most of NIKI'S timeline however Tina said the car drove up the driveway between 2:00-2:30 she never saw or heard anyone leave and I don't think a blood covered murderer could just drive quietly down the driveway after just committing such a brutal murder so that leads me to believe that the person who drove like a maniac up the driveway was Richard Izard the keys were still in the ignition and the truck was parked behind the family car. Also the bodies were still warm the temperature that day was only 78 degrees so the bodies could not have been lying there too long before Thomas got there also the body's were just beginning to show signs of livity which to me means they were killed between 2:00-2:45 also the laundry was still wet; think about it, if you put a child's dress, a couple of kitchen towels and a man's work shirt out on a lawn they will dry no more than an hour they are all thin materials. Also the little girl's cap and blankey found by the creek were wet as well as if they were part of the laundry that Mrs. Izard was going to put on the line. Just because Catlett saw her put laundry on the line around noon does not mean she didn't do several loads during the afternoon. The tire tread was a Goodyear which were put on Ford trucks Richard had a Ford Truck. We would need to find out if Richard wore size 11 shoe to see if the print cast in the garden was his or not.Lisa had injury on right forearm the other blow or blows were to her left head and shoulder which shows three blows one catches her on the arm on to the shoulder and the final blow to the head after which she crumbles to the ground. Richard fought hard for his life I can't belive Tina didn't hear anything she was such a busy body and she certainly heard the cops show up. Maybe she knows more. I agree that the murderer was right-handed. Also I think would try to stop the fight especially if she knew the other person. She may have been in the house probably in the basement if her washer was there, she takes out the load of laundry goes to hang it on the line hears a commotion goes around to the back of the house sees the fight runs dropping laundry along the way trys to intervene the attacker turns on her a couple of hits and she's dead . Richard could have been knocked unconsious temp. while the attacker did her in. Since Richard was getting pay offs from the teamsters someone may have been really pissed off enough to beat the hell out of him but had to murder him after murdering his wife since Richard would know who killed his wife. The only way I think that Little Ricky could be alive is if he was so tramatized by what he saw that he lost his memory.
rayson

Response: Very well thought out points, your timing jives with the findings. Thanks for the comments.

Note friends:

1) Jessie Danahy was laid off.

2) he is still a suspect.

3) was a union sympathizer.

4) no alibi.

5) dead(?)
t.

Response: Correct on all counts.

Alrighty, heres some things I thought of:
1) The killer is right-handed. According to the police report, all the major wounds and inflictions are on the left side of both victm's bodies. If the killer were facing the Izards when they were killed, he would naturally use his right hand and would strike the left side of Mr. & Mrs. Izard.
2) Whoever killed Mr. Izard, really had it in for him. A normal murder does not usually include dislocation of the jaw and missing teeth. Someone would have had to have a strong temper and great stregnth.
3) The attack on Mrs. Izard may have been an attempted rape of some sort. Mrs. Izard was found lying on the ground, with her legs bent, one arm to the side, and one crossing her chest. It's possible that the arm next to her was held down while she tried to protect herself with the other. Also, an abrasian was on her left cheek, indicating someone was forcing her agianst her will.

Maybe, out of rage of the layoff, one of the factory workers went to the Izard's to bully Mrs. Izard, maybe as a warning of some sort. Mr. Izard comes home, sees whats going on, and the fight starts...The only thing I cant figure is why Mrs. Izard would die.
masso

Response: 1) Quite possible. 2) Good observation. 3) Possible, but not recognized as such at the original crime scene. Thanks for the comments.

How about this,
Whoever killed the Izards, killed Lisa first. If The attacker came after Richard first, and the wife saw, her first reaction proably would be to go to the neighbors for help, even if the killer could out run her, she still have been found farhter away from Richard. However, if Richard saw Lisa being attcaked, it is reasonable to assume that he would try to save her, and be killed in a struggle right next to her body. The killing proably wasn't premeditated, the killer didn't have the intent to kill when he arrived, and if it was a union worker, why kill Lisa first? Wouldn't he have gone right for Richard? whoever did it came for Lisa.

How does this sound? Danahy comes back to reclaim Lisa, figureing she will leave Richard after she hears of the layoffs and what he has done to the workers. Lisa refuses, Jesse loses it and kills Lisa. Richard sees this and runs out to help, but he his killed in a struggle. Danahy comes to his seneses, realizes what he has done and flees. Hinkley comes by, sees the bodies, maybe with Ricky there crying or something, maybe not. Figures who ever did this may come back for the kids so he grabbs the ring and the wallet. He doesn't take the payoff money, because he doesn't know about it. Gets some one to help him. That person takes the kids away with the money to an orpahnge, different orphages maybe. Then Hinkley calls the police All this would account for the seven minute gap betwen the discovery of the bodies, and the call to the police.

Response: Lots of things to accomplish in a short time, but not necessarily impossible. Thanks for the theory.

hey did anyone read that little note under Yoknapatawpha County : Law Enforcement Dividion Evidence File?
It says that they'll answer our questions this weekend! Bejo, we'll probably get Dahany info then. personally, I'm a little suspicious of Tina Hawkins and Lydia Catlett. I think it was someone on the block. Lydia did have a son that she kept bragging about to the police. What's his name? Didn't she say that he had some union connections up North? And how does Tina Hawkins know that package was from Sears?
Niki

Response: More information on Danahy to come. Lydia Catlett's son's name is Henry. He worked in Chicago for a unionized company for a time and in 1958 lived in Jackson, MS. We can only speculate that likely Mrs. Hawkins "knew" the package was from Sears from either word of mouth or guessing based on past experience.

okay, here's a rough sketch of the events of that day relevant to the case:

8:15a Tina (Yvonne) Hawkins sees Richard and Ricky leave for work and school
9:00a (approximately) bowlan announces to Richarch that he will be firing 153 employees. Richard begs and tries to reason with Bowlan for about an hour. Bowlan leaves the factory before 10
10:00a Bowlan already on his way to Memphis Tennessee
10:30a Lydia Catlett saw Mrs. Izard with LeAnn out in the yard
11:00a Richard Izard announces the layoffs for Bowlan
11:15a Employees pick up their final checks (including Roland Jestes)
11:45a Elliot Perch arrives at Sid's, alot of laid-off workers are there getting drunk
betw. 11:45a and 12:45p Jimmy Warren arguing with Elliot Perch, causing a scene, Perch reportedly says "Up north we have a way of taking care of problems like this."
12:00p (approx.) Lydia Catlett reports seeing Mrs. Izard out with the wash "a bit before noon"
12:00p Richard Izard leaves Bowlan Glove Factory
12:10p Roland Jeste arrives at the Road House
12:30p Richard Izard arrives home
betw. 12:45 and 1:15p Elliot Perch leaves Sid's to go to the resevior
2:00p (approx.)Elroy picks up kids at North County Elementary school in bus no. 48
2:00p Earnest Jackson leaves work (works for Jed Tucker, not Bowlan)
2:10p Elroy picks up Ricky Izard and other kids at Hamblitt Elementary School
betw. 2:00p and 2:30p Tina hawkins hears a car speeding out of the Izard's driveway, and looks out to see a cloud of dust.
2:20p bus no. 48 drops off 3 children at Box 218
2:23p bus no. 48 drops off 2 children at Box 216
2:25p bus no. 48 drops off 1 child at Box 215
betw. 2:20p and 2:30 p Gladys Waring talking to Tommy Joe Hinkley
2:35p bus passes mail truck at Box 212
2:36p (approx.) bus drops off Ricky Izard at home
2:38p (approx.) bus turns around
2:40p (approx.) bus sees Ricky Izard in the driveway
2:41p Tommy Joe Hinkley arrives at Lydia Catlett's door
2:45p Tommy Joe Hinkley arrives at the Izard's
betw. 2:42p and 2:51p Tommy Joe is trying to revive Izards and looks for children
2:52p Tommy Joe makes a 911 call to report Izards's death

conclusion 1: Ricky Izard disappeared between 2:40p and 2:45p
conclusion 2: Whoever took Ricky Izard should have been seen in the area by either Tommy Joe or Elroy.
conclusion 3: since they didn't report seeing anyone unusual, whoever they saw BELONGED on that road.
conclusion 4: whoever took Ricky Izard belonged on that road
inference 1: (not a definite conclusion) many of us believe whoever took Ricky took LeAnn, we also believe whoever took the children, killed their parents. What if this isn't true? Tina Hawkins heard the car pull out really fast between 2:00p and 2:30p BEFORE the school bus came, which suggests the killer was gone BEFORE Ricky Izard came home from school. We should all keep an open mind that the killer may not have taken the children
conclusion 5: Lisa and Richard Izard died between noon and 2:45p. If Tina Hawkins did hear the killer pulling out of the driveway, they died between noon and 2:30p BEFORE Ricky came home.
Niki

Response: Excellent deductions, the coroner put the time of death closer to between 1:45 and 2:45 p.m.

PUZZLES PUZZLES
Okay how about this? The vehicle that Tina heard was Richard returning in a hurry he went to the garden to dig something up maybe that he buried.He was interrupted before he began digging(his gloves were not on)a fist fight began somebody picked up the shovel they probably started trying to get it away from each other. The Mrs. showed up while they were fighting over the shovel she got hit in the head a fatal blow when that happened Mr. Izard probably let go of the shovel to see to his wife, that was when the other person or persons finished him off. I think whoever emptied Richard's pockets and took Mrs. Izard's ring to make it look like it was a robbery but that was not the motive. Whoever took LeAnne and ran giving her to someone close. Went back by foot since we know that little Ricky was last seen by the bend in the road from there he may have seen his father's body dropped his bookbag ran to his father's body discovered his mother's body in shock he looked around picked up his sister's wet cap and blanket someone came up on him he started running toward the creek he was probably tackled or whatever by the creek he dropped the laundry on the ground and he was drowned because he knew too much.Since no car was seen leaving the scene the killer must come on foot or was dropped off. It wasn't premeditated because the murder weapon was something present at the scene. Thomas had to have heard or seen something and kept his mouth shut maybe to make sure nothing happened to LeAnne. * I too read where Thomas said his brother was a veteran although the police where talking about his brother Walter, Thomas had Aaron on his brain(he said which brother Wally or Aaron) and Aaron was a veteran. Makes me wonder why!!

I know this is really long-winded but we need to think of how the murders were comitted to try to figure by who does anybody else have any other suggestions?
[email protected]

Response: Thanks for the theory, good thoughts. One comment, the fact that no vehicle was seen leaving the scene does not necessarily mean there wasn't one. It's possible the wallet and ring were taken as a diversion. Good point that the murder weapon was something present at the scene.

hey fellow sleuth's!
here's an idea, I think that we know all we need to know about this case by now. whoever did it, we already know about them, so we can limit our list of suspects to people we have information about. so let's work together to recreate the known events on that day to find our murderer.
I'm going to go back and reviewour evidence, and post what I've found when I'm done.
Niki

Response: Thanks for the comments, look forward to your results.

I suggested that the rhyme that says "Ricky's in the river turning blue" was significant, because it points out the possibility that Ricky is dead. Think about it. Why was LeAnn the only one given to the orphanage. Why were Ricky's things found by the river? Ricky was old enough to give the murderer away, and it is very likely that he saw something.
Niki

Response: Good points. A popular theory at the time including the children drowning and that is likely the source of the chant.

Bejo,
I e-mailed Det. Nelson, and he e-mailed back that info about Jesse D. would be coming this week, but with all the delays, I'm not sure if we'll get it on time. Probably by next week though.
I understand your reluctance to give up Jesse D., but I seriously doubt that he is the suspect. He is too obvious of a suspect. Jesse D. would have been arrested or something in the last forty years. The case would not still be a mystery if a recently laid-off employee, and angry boyfriend was the murderer. I think we should concentrate on other inconsistencies.
There is new information that points to the possibility that Richard Izard was getting payoffs from the union organizers. At first I discounted it, but they did find the envelope in his drawer. There is only one other possibility, someone planted that envelope, so they wouldn't be suspected in the murders. But it is almost certain that Richard was being paid-off. That would eliminate union sympathizers from the list of suspects. If Richard was on their side, then why would they kill him. Hey, a thought just occurred to me. What if Richard was blackmailing someone?.... Nah. too complicated.
Niki

Response: Interesting idea that the envelope might have been planted to avert suspicion. Danahy was never cleared as a suspect.

Masso,
Perch and Hannah Waithers weren't seeing each other. Hannah Waithers was known to be seeing Frank Abbot (a union organizer) and Abbot was the reason that the meetings were at her house. Also, she explicitly states she was going out with Aboot that night, and that's why she was looking for a dress. Go back and read Hanna's bio, her interview, and the Hawkins's interview.
Niki

Response: Correct, thanks for the response.

this is for nikki--after i reread some notes--
houses 203 harrigill
205 jackson
206 stout
207 jestes
208 hawkins and tina and titus are married
209 izard
210 waither
211 catlett
212 blakeley
213 blamd
214 waring
215 parker
216 huggins
218 detter
considering how close that the hawkins and catlett houses are to the izard home-why didn't anyone hear anything??
you don't think that if lisa or richard saw something
horrendous happening to the other one, that they wouldn't
start yelling/screaming. that's almost a normal reaction..
..since the creek was close to the izard home,would you not believe that ricky had been told to stay away from it..i
know that i would tell my 5 year old son he is not allowed near there-boy scout or not. and why would he believe that leanne would venture down there..that's quite a walk for a
toddler. something tells me he would go next door to the neighbors (either one of them) still waiting on some type
of response to dna testing--seems like a lot of us would like some results in that area....

Response: Thanks for the comments, think you covered it on the mark.

I think it is an excellent idea to have a chat room so we can talk about the evidence and current clues...

Response: Chat details found here.

I'm confused, why was Richard Izard found dead lying on a blanket and covered up with another?? Please shed some light on that for me. If the killer was in that much of a hurry, why would he bother to lay out the blankets? Surely Richard Izard wasn't laying on the ground like that before the killer got to them!! I don't get it. I also believe that the boy was killed because he saw something, and was running from the killer(s), that's why they found traces of him near the creek. But where is his body??? Was it never recovered? I believe that Walter Hinkley and Ms. Hawkins had something to do with it. I think Walter killed them, took the little girl AND the ring, then later on, Ms. Hawkins took LeAnn to the nuns. Think about it, how did LeAnn have the ring all this time? Where did she get it, if it was stolen off Mrs Izard's body?? The thing I can't figure out is why they would take LeAnn in the first place. Unless she was crying and they thought she would attract attention to the crime scene. I truly believe Tommy Jo ( the postman) is hiding the truth to protect his brother. That's my opinion. I hope this case is soon solved so the Izard's can finally rest in peace! I also believe that Doris is telling the truth, and I think she really is LeAnn Izard. I hope she finds out the truth soon.

Response: The photograph of the bodies you refer to was taken after the crime scene was processed and the bodies were awaiting removal, that is not how the bodies were discovered. Check the original crime scene report for details here. It is possible that Ricky Izard was killed, we don't know, the body was never recovered. Some good thoughts here particularly that a crying child might draw early attention to the scene, provides another motive for removing LeAnne Izard from the premises.

It's apparent that that Perch was involved in some sort of payoff to Richard Izard. But what went wrong ? Was Richard being paid to get the union in or keep it out? Were the layoffs the trigger for the murder or the union vote? Was Perch in over his head with Organized Crime, possibly making promises about the union vote at the glove factory that he could not keep? Was Perch ever questioned about his statement that he did not even know where Izard lived but in fact had been seen there by a witness?

Response: Agreed, there were payoffs involved, but the specifics were never uncovered. Excellent questions we'd like to answer.